What are your thoughts 'Future of Palestinians and Israelis'?
What are your thoughts 'Future of Palestinians and Israelis'?
Do you have constructive ideas of how we as a community can contribute to change?
Lately some members were investing on promoting their one-sided view of the conflict, in many ways it is not what mepeace.org come to serve as we have so many one-sided sites such efforts just make members who are not in their one-side feel rejected.
As we are all here, no borders can we put aside our historic analysis and who is right who is wrong wisdom and bring in the how can we live together in one future wisdom?
a state is a tool to serve society, we have jewish society and arab society here and with all the pains of the past and present we need a governance structure and a state structure to serve all.
here is some of my thoughts:
We have two societies with very different world view, as the majority of the people are good people with good cooperative intentions, some ideologies we have in this two societies are conflicting.
The rule of the state is to contain the society and help it to focus its activity toward peaceful productive creative and safe life conditions. since we have deep gap between the Arab and the Jews we need to form two states as 1st stage. the goal of each state is to focus on reduce violence within each society and between both societies.
states have some danger as they tend to take freedom from individuals; religious freedom is one example. Many Israelis complain for having religious state and many palestinians fear from Hamas led government be such. this is a reason why we need to start create a format of confederation which will enable the autonomy of each state but can secure as higher authority to both entities freedom of religion and individual human rights and also enhance the economic power of us all.
The confederation is something we need, but we will be able to form it after we form the Palestinian state with agreed sustainable borders.
Do you have constructive ideas of how we as a community can contribute to change?
Lately some members were investing on promoting their one-sided view of the conflict, in many ways it is not what mepeace.org come to serve as we have so many one-sided sites such efforts just make members who are not in their one-side feel rejected.
As we are all here, no borders can we put aside our historic analysis and who is right who is wrong wisdom and bring in the how can we live together in one future wisdom?
a state is a tool to serve society, we have jewish society and arab society here and with all the pains of the past and present we need a governance structure and a state structure to serve all.
here is some of my thoughts:
We have two societies with very different world view, as the majority of the people are good people with good cooperative intentions, some ideologies we have in this two societies are conflicting.
The rule of the state is to contain the society and help it to focus its activity toward peaceful productive creative and safe life conditions. since we have deep gap between the Arab and the Jews we need to form two states as 1st stage. the goal of each state is to focus on reduce violence within each society and between both societies.
states have some danger as they tend to take freedom from individuals; religious freedom is one example. Many Israelis complain for having religious state and many palestinians fear from Hamas led government be such. this is a reason why we need to start create a format of confederation which will enable the autonomy of each state but can secure as higher authority to both entities freedom of religion and individual human rights and also enhance the economic power of us all.
The confederation is something we need, but we will be able to form it after we form the Palestinian state with agreed sustainable borders.
Replies to This Discussion
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Permalink Reply by Eyal Raviv on -
Interesting. What do others think?
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Permalink Reply by jerry gates on -
Long time no see Neri, Good morning!
Neri asks a question with a million answers, all of them an opinion as to how well humans can heal ideological and boundary differences after resorting to violence to make their talking points highlighted in the world body politic.
Just as a child will act out with negative behavior when lonely or tired, to get attention from a caring parent, so we all use negative actions to attract reactions which we favor selfishly. If this acting out to gain love works, the tack is repeated and expanded on as a chronic exibition of a symptom which is treated with love.
Useing emotional disruption, incitiment to violence and attacking this reactionary stance with vigor when it arises seems to be the current relationship between Israel and Palestine, Palestine reacts negativly when it's desires are thwarted time and time again, and if we are honest, Israel does exactly the same thing, as a child seeking attention, Both sides of this conflict seek solace in recognition of their plights, but never from each other, detente is never tried as a solution, the reason is clear.
Some children, after seeing what was a good reaction to their negative behavior erode into a punishing reprisal for repeating bad behavior, steer away from such ill tempered dramatism and heel to a better approach as they mature. If you seek love, giving it is better than demanding it for negative behavior. Suicide attacks prove this our well enough, they proved to gain attention to the Palestinian cause, but the negative acts turned wholly against Palestine. Detente is when both sides of an issue in conflict agree to stop negative acting out, a cease fire, and call in their peacemakers to craft negotiated solutions during a time of reletive calm, when peoples hearts are centered on this peacmaking, it is always best to show them positive results, which, in this case never come to fruit, hence peace is there in the flesh, but hatred brews in the soul. This hatred steeped in leadership's inability to project a state face which commands respect from "enemies" as a meaningful and substantive offering of true measures which lead to peace.
Such lack of fortitude in the elemental negotiations during times of detente, as in this past year,is the reason these times of reletive calm fail to secure peace for Palestine, yet Israel is secure or more so than Palestine, but the fearfullness of the holocaust's imprint in Israel psyche perhps the one marker of this conflict which always stops peace, Israel is yet quite fear filled as concerns it's security for zionist Jews and their preferred state, Israel. It is percieved that if Palestine is hailed, emergent and prosperous, Israel somhow loses it's image as the lone star of what was once Palestine. It seems Israel is so enmored with itself as to feel that any threat to it's future illustriousness and pomp is anti semitic, which is a tragic misconception, portrayed as protecting self determination for Jews, this constant alrming stance against possible Shoa from Palestine, puts a beastly face on this people for one reason, to maintain the negative feelings of Israeli towards Palestine as a nationalist work to insure the gentrification of Palestine by Israel, no matter what ensues as a state for Palestine Israel wil always seek to control and dominate it;s discourse, as we see today.
On the other hand we know that Arab Palestinians seek sovereignty, self determination, better infrastructure, civil discourse with Arab abd western Nations and basically want what Israelis now have but are hampered in achieving this status by Blockade, settlements encroachment and the damned walls of separtation, which continue to hurt Palestine, steal land and cause intense conflict as any anti wall resistance which organises beyong Palestine's borders is met with kidnap, beating and hateful discrimination from the IDF and Netenyahoo. This is not a backdrop for peace, this is a recipe for disaster. Apartheid is promoted, settlements promoted, miliary occupation condoned and illegal massacres pardoned by the US out of hand with no interest whatsoever in seeing justice done for the Palestinains but yet the USA is bent on supporting Israeli agressions in Lebanon, and Palestine and blocking the routes of opeace initiatives at the Rafah Gates by stopping the rebuilding and planning of a renewed Gaza. The enmity caused by such tragic stonewalling for so long is a dead issue now. The damage is done, no peace comes nor is it possible to have justice for Palestine if Israel dominates every discourse and stops every initiative with kidnapping, imprisonment and intimidation while Palestine as ZERO clout or world presence to even have the Goldstone report acknowledged by the foreign powers whose support leads Israel in such massacres. Indeed the feeling of futility between the negotiating parties if thick and it descends as a pall upon Palestine and Israel.
The truth of the matter is clear to witnesses of this dance of disparity between Jews and Arabs in the middle east. They need to trust more, be less suspicious, find a heart to stop seeking ever more for self while denying the responsibility that goes with agression and colonialsim against indigeonous populations. This is not cowboys and indians in the American west, with the indains hapless and over matched . Israel has taken a decidedly low road in it's mis casting of the conflict, so it can be expected that the world bpody politic will see deceptive practices that use false perception to gain land while calling it's defemders terrorists. This is a done deal this is that way it is, Israel picked this tack and strategy and will use it to the end to gain ever more for self while denying others rights because they are not Jews, this is a might is right bogoted stance, end of story, The Jews only state is a state that takes freedom from women to wear prayer shawls and pray beside men at the wailing wall, even spitting in the faces of these women. The Arabs see this, Americans see this, the world sees this, who is Israel kidding, this orthodoxy of intention manifests itself as disgusting acts of selfishness and myopic vision with always the crown upon a Jewish Israel head and all others are no even heard because that lack Jewishness.
Israel will not change voluntarily from this horrid stance against any Palestine with it's own character and flavor,which is jealousy so green that it stops Jews from seeing Palestine as a good neighbor, hence accepting and loving her as friend, a sure sign of intrenched hatred forced by years of enmity due to illegality of the State Israel against UN and world opinion. This is Israel thumbing it's nose at human rights groups and calling them anti semitic for supporting Palestinain human rights.
Note that when one group accuses human rights support bases, organisations with world presence and scope and denigrates Goldstone as an anti semite for helping Palestine, a clear psychosis is advancing with no treatment in Israel, this being the state hubris which attempts to sell bad and ill advised agression as self defense of Jews. Agression against non Jews as an accepted practice by Jewish led military nations to secure the lives and realms of Jews, looks like ethnic cleansing, massacreing Muslims who Israel says are bad to protect the segregated world that encourages and incites such wickedness is something the world doesnt do, even for it's beloved Jewish friends, for to do so is to encourage negative behavior that solicits sympathy for a while then illicits a nagging distrust of people who seem obcessed with Jewishness to the point of not seeing themselves as so fallable as to self destruct via arrogance and shamful selfishness
It is Israel inability as it is also of this site, that the Israeli's cannot accept that the negative actions they perpetrate every day in Palestine against Arabs is the sloe reason their people fear reprisal, it is an Israel problem caused by Israelis and solved by Israelis, the intransigent one is, as ever, Israel and until this woeful and hideous pride is cut down , arrogant and belligerent people find no room at the inn for others, so they remain an island of shameful self pride and prejudice. Injustice and off hand dismissal of any Isralei crimes as unimportant or not punishable in any court sends the wrong message to the rest of the planet, that message this, if we stop not these agressors they will trample human rights until all goyim struggle and suffer, True or not, this is how Israel is percieved by it's actions, the words matter not, Israel shows it's attitude to hamper it's altitude, hautiness and a pridful look is disgusting to Allah, find humility and Find peace, find it not and war comes looking for your king.
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Permalink Reply by mika laiho on -
History teaches us that men and nations behave wisely once they have exhausted all other alternatives.
~Abba Eban
War is not the continuation of politics with different means, it is the greatest mass-crime perpetrated on the community of man.
~Alfred Adler
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Permalink Reply by Paul RETI on -
So Mika are you suggesting that your prognosis is just more of the same?
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Permalink Reply by Dan Booth Cohen on -
Oh little town of Bethlehem,
How lonely do you sleep.
Made to lie on a bed of stones
Your children only weep.
Punished for crimes committed by others,
Forgotten by celebrants too busy shopping,
Ignored by the world.
Forsaken by the Prince of Peace.
To those who work for peace
Remember the little town of Bethlehem
In your prayers
On this Christmas Day.
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Permalink Reply by Christopher Glenn Bowers on -
Two of the most powerful tools for Peace we all have, we regrettably leave in our tool bags far too often. Our very powerful inherent divine ability, individually and collectively, to project the inviolate truth of Peace, and our inherent Intelligent Heart-centered ability to steer clear of rationalizing judgment of others which does nothing but reinforce and perpetuate the illusion of separation, for we are One, ever and always, regardless of the very dynamic and entrenched illusions we cling to individually and collectively.
Personally, my favorite way for projecting Peace and safety is to hold that individual, family, group, town, city, country, planet, in the Love and Light of the One Infinite Creator. According to what RA said in the Law of One sessions, it is a very powerful way to bind those held there to doing only good, or nothing at all without making any ego-based judgmental determination about anyone. In the very near future, all conflict will be dealt with peacefully and efficiently in like and similar manner. It is a beautiful thing to consider, that Peace cannot ever actually be taken away, but only abandoned willfully for a spell, and even then, the resulting experiential dynamic is merely an illusion in temporary flux that becomes a learning experience for all of us, individually and collectively, for we are ever and always One. LLP, Chris
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Permalink Reply by Paul RETI on
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So how do we ALL remember and act appropriately on the notion "that we belong to each other"?
Beautiful idea! How do we make it reality?
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Permalink Reply by Neri Bar-On on -
Chiaroscuro you may be right that we should live by the Golden Rule. Love they neighbor as thyself.
but this happend, do you think we should work for change the current reality within 5 years?
What are your thoughts 'near Future of Palestinians and Israelis'?
Do you have constructive ideas of how we as a community can contribute to change?
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Permalink Reply by Neri Bar-On on
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Nicolette
The link does not work so I can only guess you suggest "trade and business" as practice that evolve change that can enhance peace.
As the Israeli economy is ten fold more complex and strong then the Palestinian one I guess we must apply responsibility and care to make sure that the Palestinian work and product markets will not be capture by the Israeli economy.
Another issue is that the different culture of business and trade in Palestine and in Israel. while in Palestine there are dominant families with family economic while in Israel it is corporate economic. such difference can lead to corruption and abuse of the support system if that will be taken into consideration.
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Permalink Reply by Neri Bar-On on
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here is corrected lnk
[Interview] Zvi Schreiber, CEO of G.ho.st Inc.
http://english.ohmynews.com/articleview/article_view.asp?article_cl...
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