Discussion will be continued on Is Israel poisoning Palestinian lands and people?

Thanks for all tried to help especially Noa, Hiba, Max, Paul, ..

got from

Efrat Noy

you may take action as well!

I found the following related Info

The one on Palestinian side know much about those crimes is Dr Mahmoud Sa'adeh from Yatta in Hebron!

Dear All,

Yesterday (Monday) we went with Iyad to search for and photograph evidence to document the military waste and dangerous materials that the IOF leaves in the area of the Jahalin Bedouin in the south Hebron hills. Iyad took us to visit a family whose child’s leg was badly burnt a month ago when he was playing in the desert with ammunition remains left behind by the Israeli military. Nothing could have prepared us for our meeting with the boy, whose name is Jabar, even though he had received medical attention at Yata [a nearby city]. The condition of his leg is shocking, and it will be a miracle if he does not lose his leg.

This resulted from his playing with some sort of acid that resembles salt (who knows what the implications are). Jabar, who is 13 years old, is urgently in need of medical treatment.

According to Iyad and the family, the care that he received at Yata was typical of the attitude there towards the Bedouins who come there for medical care.

We contacted the Physicians for Human Rights and B’tselem, and as a result the child will go today to a hospital in Hebron, accompanied by Issa from B’tselem, and hopefully from there to a hospital in Israel.

Following our visit, we went to the dessert and found evidence of the controlled explosions that the Israeli military performs, and the salt-like waste that charred the youngster.

The military does not bother to in any way indicate the presence of the dangerous chemicals it leaves behind.

I attach pictures of the boy and of the evidence we found.

The photos were also sent to B’tselem.

Hopefully, the child will get to the hospital today, and not lose his leg.


----- Original Message -----
From: אהוד קריניס
To: Ehud Krinis
Sent: Wednesday, June 25, 2008 10:50 AM
Subject: מה ראינו באום דרג'

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Efrat Noy
Date: 24/06/2008 16:17
Subject: Fwd: מה ראינו באום דרג'

שלום לכולם

אתמול (יום שני) יצאנו עם עיד כדי לחפש ולצלם עדויות לדווחים על

פסולת נפלים ותחמושת וחומרים מסוכנים שמשאיר צה"ל

בשטחי המרעה של שבט ג'האלין המתגוררים באזור אום דרג' (מזרחה

לאום אל חיר/התנחלות כרמל). עיד לקח אותנו לבקר משפחה

ששמע כי אחד מילדיה נכווה ברגלו לפני כחודש תוך משחק במדבר עם שאריות תחמושת של הצבא.

שום דבר לא הכין את כולנו למפגש עם הילד-(ששמו ג'אבר אבן מוסא

למרות שלכאורה קיבל טיפול ביאטה, מצב הרגל שלו פשוט מזעזע

וזה יהיה נס אם לא יאבד אותה

כל זאת כתוצאה ממשחק עם איזושהי חומצה דמוית מלח (מי יודע מה ההשלכות)

הילד, בן 13, זקוק לטיפול ד-ח-ו-ף!!! לטענת עיד והמשפחה

הטיפול שקיבל ביאטה אופייני ליחס לו זוכים הבדואים בבואם לקבל טיפול רפואי מפלסטינים

לאחר שיצרנו קשר עם רופאים לזכויות אדם ועם בצלם הילד ילקח היום לביה"ח בחברון

בליווי עיסא מבצלם שידאג שלא יפלו אותו בטיפול, בתקווה שיקבל הפנייה לבי"ח בישראל.

לאחר הביקור יצאנו למדבר ומצאנו עדויות לפיצוצים המבוקרים של צה"ל ולאותו חומר דמוי מלח.

הצבא לא דאג לסמן בשום דרך את המצאותם של חומרים מסוכנים באזור

אני מצרפת תמונות של הילד ושל השטח.

התמונות נשלחו גם לבצלם.

אינשאללה הילד יגיע היום לבי"ח ולא יאבד את רגלו

להתראות לכולם


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Replies to This Discussion

Look at the focus of the initial burst acitvity, Neri.

A problem was presented here as very urgent, and needing urgent attention. This (seemingly related) claim was also made "The one on Palestinian side know much about those crimes is Dr Mahmoud Sa'adeh from Yatta in Hebron!" Dr Mahmoud Sa'adeh has not provided any substantiating information nor is there any corraboration of the calim form any source.

We still don't really know what really caused Jabar's injuries. Why not? And from the reports we seem to have received, Jabar's health issues were already being managed when the plea for urgent help was circulated.

I do care about Jabar. Some here clearly still do.

I really do not care for and about those who circulated the related misleading claims. They really seem to have done that cynically, essentially only for propaganda purposes only. I also do not care for and about those who indulged in the related IDF bashing here based upon still-to-be substantiated claims about any specifically related IDF responsibility or the supposedly related claims made by the local expert Dr Mahmoud Sa'adeh.

Yes Neri. Getting the resources may not be easy. Doing that though is impossible if the related facts are so deliberately or so so irresponsibly fuzzy.

Yes. People say that they care. People demonstrate that they really care by what they do.

The relevant points are, in my view, now really on the board.

Be well...
Dear Paul,

Please note that there are different levels of care, where someone got heart in the life conditions of south Hebron in the Palestinians territory.

Getting hurt as this young person did effects th resources of his famely, the psychological cost and the financial cost is enormous .

I witnessed few Israeli families collapse when one of the kids get injured, knowing that their social benefits and resources failed and the families braked.

Please respect this level of care when people want to give hand to someone who's life were so affected by the conflict we have. I see it as a good cause. I am proud to witness it. this is human care I wish we all have.

So this is my perspective, and we all wish Jabar health and strength and hope we will be able to deliver him in his life time new era of relationship so his many sons will enjoy this earth as any one else freely and prosperously with us .
I really do understand all that Neri. Why do you feel that its necessary to make such points? Why do you seem to imply that I do not?

Why do you seem to want to ignore my real points?

Be well.
Because this discussion topic is helping human being and I suggest that the ideological discussion we will have in a different thread .

I feel that I need to protect the call for help that expressed here for a specific person.

this is why, you do not have to accept my view.

I am also writing this because I am interested in the Big picture, the fact that this story is helping the bashers to show how right they are should not be a reason not to help Jabar.
I really want to see if we can help Jabar. That was and is my focus. Please read what I've really written in this discussion Please note my many early attempts to focus this discussion on Jabar only. Please note the responses to that persistent suggestion.
hi neri, what do you mean by the 'bashers'? i think this story's details are filling out nicely and deeply. Noa D's contact with Ezra explains in detail the boy's medical treatment and the way in which they all got involved with extracting dangerous metal from a dump. It really is a deep example of structural violence that has no direct linkage to a malevolent act, unlike close-up shootings that go on with rubber bullets, or training in suicide bombing. this is about legalized displacement from land, the consequences, absolute poverty, racial prejudice of all against bedouin. dealing in dangerous metals out of desperation. it is a much more universal story. Anyway, Ezra's path is the righteous one. And i admire everyone here for taking such a passionate interest in the boy. for me it is where i hoped dialogue on mepeace would always move. finally, if this dump is really the land that was promised to the tribe when the area of ma'ale adumim was taken from them then this is a very profound symbol of how displacement kills people without a shot being fired. at a deeper level the parents are merely sharing their 'inheritance' of the dump with the children, who are suffering from it. It seems to me that larger answers will require the people of ma'ale adumim, or some portion of them, to develop a conscience about who was on that land first, to care for them as equals, and as those who they may owe a debt to.
Thank you for your words and support.

I think in we have a grate potential as a community to make more of such actions in a sustainable way.
I have recieved this e-mail, thank you for reminding me Paul.

hay hiba
i'm sorry that i answer you just now, time is running really fast hear..
about the boy- i know that his condition is really getting better, he stood on his lag, and he is having a treatment in hebron hospital
i won't be here for the next month but if you want to keep updating or even go to visit him you can call efrat: (-------) , she will give you all the details
all the best, and good luck with your important work
with solidarity

I have efrat's number, any ideas?
do we know or can we find out if any formal institution is doing investigation on this case and get any info about root cause?
Ok Wael, what kind of institutions you are thinking of? law? human rights? health care?

In Israel? Palestine? abroad?
I tried hard to get a snap shot on this subject in general, but failed!
we have fragmentations of info .. but nothing "official"

I am thinking about those do investigation works on the ground; it does not matter where they come from.

So I like also to have a whole picture about the reality.
You know the Israelis have expertise in that ..... if we just have same capacities for supporting peaceful pro-life activities ....



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